Complaint: ImprovedName

[Nik707]

Stellar, big point here, I did what I was told to by the head cultist. He was, for all intents and purposes, my boss. Nowhere in what you linked does it say what we did is at all against any rule, nor does it excuse how he handled it. So bwoinking that would essentially get you absolutely nowhere. Engine sabotage is not against the rules, nor is it ever leading to people getting 'messed with' like admins claim it will.
Flynn, keep it on topic bud.

[StellarWolf]

Stellar, big point here, I did what I was told to by the head cultist. He was, for all intents and purposes, my boss. Nowhere in what you linked does it say what we did is at all against any rule, nor does it excuse how he handled it. So bwoinking that would essentially get you absolutely nowhere. Engine sabotage is not against the rules, nor is it ever leading to people getting 'messed with' like admins claim it will.
Flynn, keep it on topic bud.

Sabotaging the tesla...Tesla is unpredictable. Clever head cultist you had. You could have easily argued against their orders. Considering that tesla could easily ruin their round by killing you all as the cultist or destroy the objective points. As for Engine sabotage being against the rules? I said nothing about that. I was saying to bwoinking about stupidly ruining the antag round if it ended up causing that. Read my first sentence. Unpredictable. Highly. Releasing it just for the sake of chaos on a round that is Cultist or Revs is just a baaaad idea. Any other round? Go for it kiddo. Have fun causing havoc.

But enough about this, the original issue was about admin Improved. What if the part was that he thought that the shuttle brig DID actually remove someone from a round? That's what I see from what was said by him over DM's.

And to be honest, I thought the same thing after the round ended. He never gave his intentions though, so I ran out of the brig to go with everyone else. Shuttle brig was too small for my liking naturally. But then I ran into George who thought I was Cassius. Obviously changing my name to his created a big mishmash of confusion and prevented my death, which almost UTTERLY ruined his round due to being killed. That biggest part makes me feel the worst due to what involvement I have with this.

[StellarWolf]

This isn't a complaint against Ty/Johnny, Stellar. Ty brought it up because it was related to the topic at hand.

I know, I edited my post and added things.

[FGRSentinel]

But enough about this, the original issue was about admin Improved. What if the part was that he thought that the shuttle brig DID actually remove someone from a round? That's what I see from what was said by him over DM's.


And to be honest, I thought the same thing after the round ended. He never gave his intentions though, so I ran out of the brig to go with everyone else. Shuttle brig was too small for my liking naturally. But then I ran into George who thought I was Cassius. Obviously changing my name to his created a big mishmash of confusion and prevented my death, which almost UTTERLY ruined his round due to being killed. That biggest part makes me feel the worst due to what involvement I have with this.

Except that if you look on the statbus for his "make sure x doesn't escape alive" objective, it actually identifies it after the fact as "/datum/objective/maroon" which implies if you leave via shuttle or pod in any way while alive, they fail the objective.

As I said above, his claimed goal of disguising as you to lure other lings out holds no water because everything he did (revealing that the lings were after you to you directly, working with security on the matter, and repeatedly linking you to the ling hive mind, which we see) made every ling unwilling to work towards that objective, which rendered his supposed plan a near impossibility. After that he even explicitly stated he was going to have sec pressure the lings if they didn't show themselves, which would lead to security killing any lings Cassius could identify, not him absorbing them. The entire plan, when you stop to think about it, holds water. If he was trying to use you as bait like he claims, he would have changed into you, turned you into someone else, and then went around on his merry way until we attacked him.

As SomanBat said, it's extremely unlikely that he didn't know it wouldn't work even if you stayed in there.

[StellarWolf]

But enough about this, the original issue was about admin Improved. What if the part was that he thought that the shuttle brig DID actually remove someone from a round? That's what I see from what was said by him over DM's.


And to be honest, I thought the same thing after the round ended. He never gave his intentions though, so I ran out of the brig to go with everyone else. Shuttle brig was too small for my liking naturally. But then I ran into George who thought I was Cassius. Obviously changing my name to his created a big mishmash of confusion and prevented my death, which almost UTTERLY ruined his round due to being killed. That biggest part makes me feel the worst due to what involvement I have with this.

Except that if you look on the statbus for his "make sure x doesn't escape alive" objective, it actually identifies it after the fact as "/datum/objective/maroon" which implies if you leave via shuttle or pod in any way while alive, they fail the objective.

As I said above, his claimed goal of disguising as you to lure other lings out holds no water because everything he did (revealing that the lings were after you to you directly, working with security on the matter, and repeatedly linking you to the ling hive mind, which we see) made every ling unwilling to work towards that objective, which rendered his supposed plan a near impossibility. After that he even explicitly stated he was going to have sec pressure the lings if they didn't show themselves, which would lead to security killing any lings Cassius could identify, not him absorbing them. The entire plan, when you stop to think about it, holds water. If he was trying to use you as bait like he claims, he would have changed into you, turned you into someone else, and then went around on his merry way until we attacked him.

As SomanBat said, it's extremely unlikely that he didn't know it wouldn't work even if you stayed in there.

I have to agree that this was all a big bad case I got myself into. But the bottom line is that I was brought into it without intentions. I went into the round normally and not expecting anything, including my death. Then I get PDA'd and things completely changed. Him continuing to changeling link me was me replaying it out even though I knew very well OOC that this was bad to be involved in. Ended up in more problems then it was need especially since I was being stupid and not going through my borging.

As for the boasting for having sec pressure the other lings? I don't think he should have even did that. It was just being a jerk at that point. Still not going to hate him for it, but I just would hope he wouldn't cause anything more like this.

[FGRSentinel]

Why didn't you go through with the borging anyways? That's something I'm curious about since if you got borged Improved could still pretend to be you and bait the other lings into attacking him.

[StellarWolf]

Why didn't you go through with the borging anyways? That's something I'm curious about since if you got borged Improved could still pretend to be you and bait the other lings into attacking him.

He kept telling me that a ling needed my brain. So I dropped it and just went with going with his plan. Then I found out at the end scree that the lings didn't. I couldn't just borged myself.

[SomanBat]

IvI' been trying to give the benefit of the doubt, but at this point I can't.

Had ImprovedName been following the rules, this would have been a dirt simple green text. Let Stellar Borg, get ID and genome, DNA sting everyone, transform at last minute.

Instead, he blatantly lied to Stellar about other ling objectives, and used a convoluted plan with no chance of success that just so happened to protect his long term ERP buddy (whom he went sosfar as to revive on CC for an ERP session in another round) from harm.

I'm sorry, but this is a case of metafriending and friendtagging, with a hastily constructed "plan" tacked on after the fact when caught.

[Pascal123]

Well, from my understanding. The thing with Antagonists is that Antagonists can do whatever Antagonists want to do. Barring certain things and circumstances.
Being a Changeling, in and of itself does not make you a "Team Antag", simply because you have a channel to communicate privately with other Changelings. It is not at all similar to, say. Nuclear Operatives. Sometimes, Changelings have competing objectives, sometimes. They have objectives they can work together on. But if or when, or how, they choose to work together or back-stab each-other is left at their personal discretion. It may seem dick-ish. But, Changelings have many ways to avoid detection, or having their intentions known. It's quite literally an antagonist based on deceiving people.

And, to that extent. As silly as it may sound. Antagonists do not necessarily even have to be accomplishing their objectives, should they choose not to.
However, in this case. I believe they had a plan, but said plan did not go according to plan. And, I'm pretty sure Antagonists can actually complete their maroon objective, so long as their target is in the shuttle's brig area. The same way antagonists can fail their "escape alive" objective. By being in the brig area.

[SomanBat]

To quote server rules: Do your objectives. A minimum effort is required when you are an antagonist, especially in team antag roles. Failing your objectives is not punishable, actively working against them is. If you don't want to do your objectives, ask an admin to hand the role off to someone else.

Actively protecting your maroon target would be working against your objective. Talking your maroon target out of borging ( which would handily achieve the same) is working against your objective. Linking your maroon target to the hive mind when you know OTHER changelings have compatible objectives to yours, working against your objective.

As I said previously, no rules would have been broken had ImprovedName let Stellar be borged, took his ID and genome, then collected genomes for his other objective. As it stands, he took actions directly opposed to his objectives, in order to protect a "metabuddy". His plan being valid hinges on ignorance of a game mechanic, which is kind of bad for an admin, and hard to believe when said admin was lauded for his upstream contributions in his admin app.