Warning Complaint Recieved From: SevnTohno

[Kris P Kreme]

BYOND Name of complaint against: SevnTohno

Your BYOND name: Kris.P.Kreme0

Date of issue and round ID: 10/17/2017 Round ID:9889

Reason for complaint:


I was warned for "poor ic escalation" despite being attacked twice by the person who was using a crowbar in a lethal way against me.

http://tinypic.com/r/6r0v2c/9

Here is the first encounter, i do not like people who are far from their posts in my chapel, thus I ask him to leave a few times. He decides its a good idea to flash me, which leaves me vulnerable. Therefore i threatened him to scare him off. After this i went off to build a little hydroponics space in the chapels mass driver area since i have the extra space. I come back to find them all dismantled with Aidan Miller in the corner of the room fucking with the pieces, naturally i figured it was him so i punched him. Keep in mind that podmens punch verb is slash despite not being sharp at all.

http://tinypic.com/r/257f2ab/9

Here is the second encounter, after we begin to brawl he runs off after he realizes hes getting beaten. I did in fact throw the first punch but i figured it was warrented seeing as he destroyed a bunch of my equipment that i was going to grow things with. We end up and sec because of course this guy decides to go there instead of fight, and we both try to get the security guards to help. Of course however shitsec is shitsec and decided to go and do a bunch of nothing leaving us to deal with this altercation alone. As you can see he wasnt stabbed at all, as he was merely minorly bruised from my fist, a knife would have left him severely bruised from the amount of times i punched him.

http://tinypic.com/r/15p4bnr/9

http://tinypic.com/r/a9slu/9


This is the third and final altercation involving both of us before i decided to kill him right then and there. As you can see i clearly didnt start this last one and was attacked first, again lethally. So, me figuring he must be a antag to put this much effort in being an ass, i pump him full of morphine, rip off his legs, and soul shard him. He then ahelped in which the admin mentioned above, SvenTohno claimed it was "poor escalation" on my end and, in his own words:

http://tinypic.com/r/2it1rie/9

He claims that i was in the wrong somewhat, despite being antagonized all round by this random medical doctor. The purpose of this complaint is to remove this warning as it was unrightfully given to me seeing as i was provoked twice out of the three encounters me and this player had. As a player i should be able to defend myself after being attacked ICly without having to worry about getting a warn because they ahelped first in a situation of which they fucked up in. They being the aggressor that is.

[A.Echard]

From the start, you were needlessly hostile with him. Instead of going 'Please smoke somewhere else' you jumped to grabbing them. Logs show you throwing the first punch to the second altercation when getting Security would have been a smarter thing to do than going to them already in a fight. The third, very important, if you're going to kill someone and soulstone them, be goddamned sure they're actually an antagonist or it's willing. Unless someone above has something to say about it, you'll have to deal with having a note for this situation.

[Tekoro]

I mean a warning is better than a secret note and that's it imo, plus it's not even that bad of a note so, it literally just describes the scenario that happened and that's it, notes don't have to be extreme punishments, sometimes they're there literally just to act as notes

[Kenzie]

this was poor escalation though

[Kris P Kreme]

"Murder is only justifiable as long as it was properly escalated.
You can’t go from a single rude punch to a knife in the neck. You can, however, go from a single punch to a counter punch to a brawl to using weapons, and so on.
Other IC justifications may exist for murder, but these are on a case by case basis.
Minor aggravations like demotions, pranks, insults, or thefts are not adequate justification."

According to the rules i didnt go overboard with my actions, except maybe the soulshard, which even though it was extra, has been justified by rule number 1 subrule 5. He immediately rushed to lethals in a fist fight which of course made me assume he was a antag, along with him attacking me in the second fight first, aka the 3rd encounter between us. This all began with antag like behavior (being outside the medbay doing nothing on a blue shift) along with just being a medical doctor and having a flash somehow. The first altercation was fairly early in the shift, making it even more suspicious then it already was ti begin with. If someone griefs, acts like a major dick, and tries killing someone else twice, they should expect to die if they fail especially if its a Chaplain. If you can explain why it seems like poor ic escalation to you it'd help me with the admin definition of it so i can at least avoid dealing with things like this in the future. And by the way, sec wasnt trying to solve anything as you can see from their behavior. The reason why i dislike having this note is because people like Durgit have been perma'd for their note history, so id like to try keep my notes as clean as possible.

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Now assuming that he was following the rules, all of his behavior was suspicious and borderline self antagging. Is it my fault that he didnt follow the rules and lead me to believe that he was a antag?

[Tekoro]

By lethals did you mean a pocket crowbar which does less damage than punches? Or what did he use?
Alright I checked better and essentially he hit you, what, once with the pocket crowbar in the head and you proceeded with syringes, idk what you had in those because I still haven't logdived, but you proceeded to use your darkblessing right after the syringes while he was using a pocket crowbar. Couldve easily just dropped him with disarm and memed him out of the chapel or wherever you where, instead of murdering him with the dark blessing and then sharding him
And if you think his behaviour was going around the lines of selfantagging, should've ahelped instead of taking it into your own hands, unless you did

[Kris P Kreme]

The syringes had morphine, i was helping with medical that wound so i had access. He didnt go down after two shots however. How much damage the crowbar actually does is invalid, citadel is considered MRP so i had a ic reason to fight back. Another fact that its not too uncommon for some nerd antag on cit to use a crowbar to try to kill someone, a perfect example would be when i tricked my would be killer into gibbing themselves n a xenobio shield generator before they could bring out a crowbar during a IA round.

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And the thing was, i just thought he was a shitty antag after he kept on with it, no reason to ahelp a shit antag player usually.

[Tekoro]

They could've thought the same about you, you had a chaplain bladearm, maybe you even changed clothes idk, and the guy got scared and it escalated into that clusterfuck
Also it does matter since it's a matter of escalation / Pocket crowbar to the head -> Legs cut off with a blade arm then soul sharded, doesn't seem very well escalated to me
Could've at the very least put them in crit, subdued them with cuffs or something, healed them and threw them in the brig
No one is telling you that you can't defend yourself, just try to not act antaggish when you aren't an antag, killing someone for hitting you a couple of times over the head with a pocket crowbar and then sharding them seems antagbehaviour

[Kris P Kreme]

Them attacking me in the firstplace after the fight is over with is antaggish behavior. Chaplains dont have any reason to think space law procedures would be a good idea, along with the fact that sec was full of useless assholes who'd perma brig me on the spot since they could care less about whether it was warranted or not. Your argument about him potentially being scared is zilch considering nothing he says or does IC shows this at all, even after i threatened him he kept coming back.

[Tekoro]

If you think their behaviour was antaggish, again, should've ahelped them instead of murdering them and sharding them on your own