[Main] Dapnee, poor judgement, antag bias

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Dapnee
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Re: [Main] Dapnee, poor judgement, antag bias

Post by Dapnee »

This conversation is a roundabout and honestly has gone nowhere.

Your note history shows similar behavior a year beforehand and then a lull in the middle I can only assume is you not playing on the server. Your “final warning” was me telling you to shape up or receive a ban. Your behavior of jumping to surgery/actively being hostile to people that actually take the time to talk with you as security is not a fun environment, it’s low to nrp. You’re not a doctor, and we’re telling you you shouldn’t just assume stealth implants without putting effort into backing it up. If I had watched you searching the dead traitors workplace even a smidge, I’d of been fine with your reasoning to check.

You need to play with a higher standard as security, or I’ll give you a break from the server to think about it. I’ll bug headmins to finish this conversation.

Nayser
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Re: [Main] Dapnee, poor judgement, antag bias

Post by Nayser »

Dapnee wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:42 am
This conversation is a roundabout and honestly has gone nowhere.

Your note history shows similar behavior a year beforehand and then a lull in the middle I can only assume is you not playing on the server. Your “final warning” was me telling you to shape up or receive a ban. Your behavior of jumping to surgery/actively being hostile to people that actually take the time to talk with you as security is not a fun environment, it’s low to nrp. You’re not a doctor, and we’re telling you you shouldn’t just assume stealth implants without putting effort into backing it up. If I had watched you searching the dead traitors workplace even a smidge, I’d of been fine with your reasoning to check.

You need to play with a higher standard as security, or I’ll give you a break from the server to think about it. I’ll bug headmins to finish this conversation.
We're discussing not my past notes here, we're discussing one you left, stop changing the topic. I do not speak pickaxe to the head language incase you consider it a language, i absolutely reasonably retaliate and you're telling me it's wrong. What you're basicly saying is i should talk to antagonist while they are actively trying to talk to me by killing me without any speech whatsoever? And even if we imagine antag did try to talk first, where is it written that security is not allowed to apprehend antags just because they talked?
Yes i was not a doctor, yet it's allowed to surgerise as different jobs, at this point you are confusing this server with hrp one, where it's commonly disallowed to have skills that aren't from your department. Like i said many times, i have put effort into backing up my reasoning and explained how i did it.
So basicly you're saying that if you saw me check the traitor's crime scene i would've been in the green? What makes you not trust me i checked the crime scene? Doesn't that just mean i am litterally in the good? Because you basicly just said if i had investigated it would be fine and i spent like 3 pages of this thread explaining to you i investigated, including the ahelps, you have shown no signs of doubting that it's truth before and kept telling me it's not good enough reason, now you suddenly do think it's a good enough reason? At this point i am confused. And please stop pretending like antags are pinnacle of hrp, most of roleplay stops and gameplay begins when antags decide to go loud which they frequently do and you're basicly telling that me stopping them decreases server to lrp? Besides, roleplay is meant to be acting like one would do if it was real life. I am pretty sure everyone would shoot a dangerous enemy instead of stopping to talk to him since it's absolutely realistic and reasonable.

This conversation is roundabout and gone nowhere because you are still doding the main question and different people are talking for you for some reason. Let me repeat the main question: how does rule about valid hunting apply to me? And why did you bend the rule about searching for antagonist equipment?
Keep in mind, this isn't the server, it's the forum, things are not correct just because you said so in here. I was checking a confirmed antagonist and rules roughly say i may search confirmed antagonists all i want. And i just can't find any excuse to make valid hunting rule apply to me, it's just ridiculous. I am begining to think you accidently opened wrong server rules and following them.

Please answer directly the main question.
Do not elaborate to me what is the final warning.
Do not tell me about past notes, we're discussing one you left.
I want you to elaborates the note you left only according to citadel's main server rules and not rulings you came up with. If you cannot, then i believe you're in the wrong here. Here is link to correct server rules https://katlin.dog/citadel-rules/main

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Fractious
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Re: [Main] Dapnee, poor judgement, antag bias

Post by Fractious »

Hi there, I'm following up on this appeal after reading the whole conversation.

To make things short, I think that in this context the implant search was valid. Implant searches tend to be iffy to judge when they are valid or not to do since they are antag knownledge after all. But judging by this context and the proof that you had stacked against the person, I believe that in this scenario it was fine.

If you actually saw them steal/use any rare items in the round and found their prints on another sensitive item that resulted to lead you to the traitor body, it's indeed fair to do a surgery on them. Especially if you couldn't find the item anywhere else after having searched for a while.

An implant search is not valid when :
  • You do not know there are Syndicate Agents aboard the station
    You do not know that the person is a Syndicate Agent
    You haven't seen the person steal the item or have any proof they did
    You haven't searched for the item anywhere else first (Bag, their departement and such)
Considering this Scenario and what Nayser said :
Nayser wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 1:02 am
I didn't go out of my way for a search, the search was litterally part of my way, after defeating blob i investigated missing items which led me back to traitor corpse. Searching a dead traitor for an implant because i found their prints all over stolen item places is a pretty clear and justifiable reason given IC'ly i am COMPLETELY/FULLY aware of what gear syndicate operatives can use.
We can see there that they indeed knew that the person was a Syndicate Agent, they also found their prints on a Stolen Item that was missing despite them searching their whole inventory.

Considering all of this, I am currently in favor of lifting the note if no one has anything to add or if I missed something. I'll leave the appeal up for 24 hours and I'll lift it if no one opposes to it. I'll also ping Dap so they may add something if they wish.

Godspeed.
Fractious
Just try your best, and worse case scenario you will fail and learn.

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